[Stark]

I am curious as to how many people on the forum consider themselves to be "professional breeders" and what is it that sets them apart from what is commonly referred to as BYB on the forum. I have read some of the post that say they should be willing to follow the dogs they sell and be willing to accept a dog back if necessary. I have seen some sites where the buyer must sign a contract agreeing to return the dog should it be necessary to find the dog a new home. If that is the case do you refund the buyers money for the purchase price if not please explain why you wouldn't.

[rutylr]

I don't like the word professional as it sounds like a job with an income.
I breed every 3 to 4 years .When ever I need a new puppy to show.
The female I breed must have a title in every registery she is registered with and then pass all the health clearences she is tested for.
I breed for my self first,keeping 2 to 3 puppies for me.
The rest are either given to people I really know who will show them,or if someone is on my list I don't know so well I will sell the pup.
I ask way below the going price as they are animals and people should not be making a living on their pets.
I sell only pets.I give no breeding rights to anyone.That has to be earned.By showing me you are responsible and are only looking for the breeds best intersts.
I do have a contract.I do say in the contract that all dogs must be returned to me if the buyer can no longer keep the dog.I do not give any money back as I am not a bank holding money for you till you decied you want it.You should be purchasing the dog forever.
Tho sometimes things happen and the dog should always go back to the breeder.
If anyone breeds dogs that are AKC registered you must per AKC rules keep track of those puppies you produce.If they come and want to see your records and you can not produce them you will get fined.

[BoerboelLover]

Hi I am a new member I am Jaime Murray of NJ. I am a Borboel breeder, and I have all my dogs live in the house with me. My dogs are Penn hip certified, registered and also I do not breed for looks. I breed for health and temperment. Looks are secondary. What is the use of having a good looking dog that can not do the job it was bred for.
JAime

[DiggityDogs]

Originally Posted by BoerboelLover

Hi I am a new member I am Jaime Murray of NJ. I am a Borboel breeder, and I have all my dogs live in the house with me. My dogs are Penn hip certified, registered and also I do not breed for looks. I breed for health and temperment. Looks are secondary. What is the use of having a good looking dog that can not do the job it was bred for.
JAime

Just curious- since you breed for function before form, do you train and compete in protection?

Psst.. tossing this question in since it was kind of brought up along the way... hope it makes sense:
Doesn't the standards (AKC presumably?) have temperament requirements as well as structure? What I am getting at is if you breed "to the standard", you would be breeding for temperament as well, right?

[SmoothCollieluver]

Originally Posted by Stark

I am curious as to how many people on the forum consider themselves to be "professional breeders" and what is it that sets them apart from what is commonly referred to as BYB on the forum. I have read some of the post that say they should be willing to follow the dogs they sell and be willing to accept a dog back if necessary. I have seen some sites where the buyer must sign a contract agreeing to return the dog should it be necessary to find the dog a new home. If that is the case do you refund the buyers money for the purchase price if not please explain why you wouldn't.

I consider myself a "professional" in that I follow the genitics of all my dogs. I eye test and test for gray collie syndrome. We check hips and pretty much know what to expect from the two lines that we work with. We take puppies back. And it does happen about everyother year. Usually as older adults and try to place them in retirement homes or they just stay with my counter part. I do not refund unless the dog had some genitic problem that i should have known about. There is no reason to give someone thier money back because they made a poor life choice for themself and the dog. They lost the dog a chance at a forever home as a pup not me. And to this date i have never had an issue with anything like that, knock on wood. I do know that one of my dogs ended up in rescue in canada. I offered to take it back but they already had a home lined up for her. And they gave my contact information to the new owner.

[SmoothCollieluver]

Originally Posted by ClarkFarm

Psst.. tossing this question in since it was kind of brought up along the way... hope it makes sense:
Doesn't the standards (AKC presumably?) have temperament requirements as well as structure? What I am getting at is if you breed "to the standard", you would be breeding for temperament as well, right?

It depends on the breed. I think most do so yes. All standards are not set up the same way so i can't really say from breed to breed.

[rutylr]

I think yes as the standards do call for temperment in them.
Plus if it is a working breed,Hunting,guarding,herding,secnt,sight,or gound woring dog.They should also have some sort of preformance title.As the dog was bred to do stuff and should prove it worthness to be bred.
We don't need the breeds to go the way of the Irish setter.It has taking them years to get working ethics back into the breed.

[DiggityDogs]

I think it should be said that dogs SHOULD be bred for looks to a certain extent, now it may be that the AKC world has changed a breed, like the GSD because of a fad or trend in the way people like their dogs to look, but truthfully, for a dog to perform it's duties, it must be structurally correct as well as temperamentally sound. You could never race a greyhound that was under or over angulated because they'd never be able to keep up with a dog with correct shoulders, hips, and knees. Same with working dogs- a severe over bite would cause a dog to not have as good of a grip as he should, so I think that it's more about improving the AKC standard, but part of the issue here is the judging system. It's so freaking political now that I've seen dogs finish that would normally be laughed out of the ring, just because of their handler. I really like the judging system for the alle rasse gruppe. They do a rating system, so your dog doesn't have to beat the other dogs to get the points, it just has to earn an appropriate rating from three different judges, and then groups and best are judged by a panel of judges instead of just one.

[BelovedJuggernaut]

I am not a breeder as of yet, but one day I hope to be.

I want to breed TM's in hopes of keeping the breed the way it is. I plan on making EVERY buyer sign a contract, plan on breeding only one litter a year - if that, having all dogs OFA tested for hips/elbows/thyroid, researching the genetic background & any disease in my dogs history. Spaying/neutering if my dogs or their pups have any disorder that I should have seen. I do also plan on taking pups back if they need to come home, providing a list of trainers and refferences to each home and send each pup home microchiped. I want to be there for the new owners and the pup even after it goes to its new home. I want the owners to feel comfortable calling me with questions any time.
As far as refunding a buyer, I don't know. If they get the pup and there is NOTHING wrong with the pup and they just don't want it anymore, then NO. If there was a problem I should have seen or was produced because of the parents, then of course. I would refund them, and take the pup back if they didn't want it.
Also, all pups are sold WITHOUT breeding rights until they are 2 years old and OFA tested for hips/elbows/thyroid and pass all tests. I don't want to contribute to the breeding of substandard dogs.

I guess before I even think about breeding, I want a few titles under my dogs belts. I want them to breed because they have something going for them for AKC and worldwide.