Avoiding dog attack

[tftmom]

I have had an ongoing problem with neighbors who allow their larger dogs to run out at my Toy Fox Terriers when I am walking them. Last week a neighbor's dog ran out toward my dogs. I told her to get her dog. she said, "Oh, she's fine." I swung a section of hose at the dog who dove under the hose and grabbed one of my dogs. I rushed her to the vet where surgery was performed. She was treated for three more days and died four days after the attack. I am now afraid to walk my remaining dog. Animal control has told me I can use a stick or use mace. My vet said that nothing is going to stop a dog determined to attack. Any advise on what has worked for others would be appreciated. I feel like a prisoner in my home and my dog misses walking.

[chacha]

What happened to the dog that attacked and killed yours? Do you have any kinds of laws in your state for this kind of problem? Isn't there any way you could go after the owners to keep the dogs chained or within a fence. I would check with your local police to find out what you could do insted of carrying around Mase and a bat.

[seraphicia]

I know how you feel, there's a shepherd across the street from my house that stays in the yard and guards it and attacks anyone who come within its perimeter. He has attacked my lab once, and my mailman has been bitten by him once, and a second close call was avioded by using mase. Its reasonable for your own protection if there aren't any official rules to safeguard you or your pet to carry mase just incase. It may very well work and may be needed, if only for your peace of mind. I would suggest depending on the neighborhood that you do a petition if you've already tried talking to the owners. Just don't take it too far and try to target all dogs, only the one(s) that has showed the aggression and that the stupid owners obviously aren't being responsible for. I'd suggest bugging animal control to enforce any applicable viscious dog law such as one in my county that focuses on any dog who has killed before. If there isn't a guideline governing that, you should take it up with your community, but I encourageyou to definitly NOT make it breed specific, but include responsibility for the owner, and you could have an impact for the safety of your community and yourself. Chances are you aren't the only person around fearful of that dog and its negligent owner. That incident is grounds for some serious action whether it be legal or not. I'm sorry for your loss, Becca

[tftmom]

I had reported the incident to animal control the day of the attack and let them know my dog died. Animal control is investigating and promised to let me know if any action is taken against the dog.

[StarWhisper]

tftmom, I am very sorry to hear about your dog. My deepest condolences.

You contacted animal control and said they were investigating. Please let us know what happens.

In the meantime if you have other neighbors that this has affected...(maybe their dogs have been attacked, you may want to ask them to step forward).

Right now however that does not solve your concerns about the safety of your other dog, I say get the license and carry the mace and be prepared to use it if necessary.

It's a shame that is has to come to this. This is exactly why I can't stand irresponsible pet owners.

[Canis Humanis]

I'm so sorry to hear about your dog. :(

Might be a good idea to keep in contact with the people handling your case.

StarWhisper is right about contacting the neighbor's. You never know what they've encountered.

Make sure when you use the Mace, you hit the irresponsable owner square in the face, so none gets on their dog.

[tftmom]

Thanks Canis Humanis I've already had that thought, glad to know I'm not the only one!

I'm not sure about the mace. Animal control says they use it but a neighbor (yes, I have been talking to my neighbors) told me a friend used mace against an attacker, the wind was blowing the wrong way and she maced herself. I've also looked into stun batons but I've been told that if I use it on a dog (and I assume the same would be true if I used it on the owner) and the dog died, I could be charged with cruelty.

I agree, it is the owner who is responsible. Still, I need some ideas to deter an attacking dog just so I can get my dogs safely away. I will use extreme force on another dog if I feel it is necessary to protect my own and myself. But I need to know what others have done successfully because it has been over a month and I still can't walk around my neighborhood. I've taken my dogs to a few parks, which they like, but our morning routine of walking is broken, they know it and they are as depressed as I am. I feel like I'm placing them in danger whenever I take them out the front door. It is no way to live.:(

[Canis Humanis]

The experience you have been through was about as traumatic as it gets.

Your fearful state will not help your situation, but I understand it completely!

I did not witness what happened. Did the dog shake your dog when she had hold of it? If so, your dog may have been viewed as "prey". I wonder if that dog had already killed another animal? This dog is "unstable", and it's the owner's fault. If the right person owned this dog, I doubt this would have happened. IMO, a dog is a reflection of the owner.

This may sound impossible for you to do, but your body language and what you project when you walk your dogs must say "confident". Any yelling or fearful body language, will only fuel the fire.

Dogs are not out there "premeditating" on ways to do you harm. It's important to understand this, to keep control of your fear.

You must walk as if you own the world and are comfortable in it. Your dog must not walk in front of you. If another dog sees this, you will not look like a "leader", but a "follower". If your dog is out in front of you, they will also be making decisions and sending signals to other dogs. You do need to respect the yards and boundaries of dogs on their own "turf". But again, they are only doing what's natural to protect their own territory if they bark as you pass by.

Practice this in a place you feel safe, in order to build your confidence. Getting control of your fear is very important right now.

Check into the various forms of Mace and Pepper sprays. They may make some that hit the target better than others. Just having it with you, can help you control your fear and give you more confidence, because you will not feel helpless.

You asked what others do? The places I walk my dog and work with clients' dogs, I consider mine. The dogs are behind me, and I deal with any other dogs with my attitude of an absolute leader. The dogs have to get through me, to get at the dogs I am with. I've had to stop two charging dogs at 30 feet from me, with a deep bark of "OUT! GET OUT". I'm sure what those two dogs saw, was a human who meant business, backed up by two other dogs. Getting attacked or feeling fear does not even enter my mind. They skidded to a halt and ran. I wasn't about to wait until they got closer, to make my point.

Are there situations where this will not work? Of course. But the alternative of just standing there and getting attacked, is not an option for me. It is not in my nature. :D

[tftmom]

I have always obedience trained my dogs. They were in the healing position on my left side. The woman was walking her dogs going the same direction. She stopped several times and I stopped to to keep about three houses between us. When she reached the corner she crossed and went down another street. As I approached the corner, I heard her yell and saw the dog flying toward us. I yelled for her to get her dog. She didn't move but said "oh, she's O.K." I pulled my dogs behind me, stepped toward the dog, yelled "No!" and swung at the dog with the section of hose I carried with me. The dog, an Australian Cattle dog mix, dove under the hose and grabbed my dog severing one kidney, damaging the other also puncturing the liver and pancreas. All in one bite on a 5 lb. dog. I pulled the dog off who then lunged at my other dog. I held it in a choke hold at which point the owner crossed the street, slipped the collar back over its head and declared my dog "fine." My vet tried to save her but she died three days later from kidney failure.

[Canis Humanis]

Geeze! That dog was locked on target. The yelling fueled the fire, but I think you did the best you could do under the circumstances. You were doing everything right from what you told me.

I hope you are getting somewhere with the investigation and aren't feeling so afraid.

The whole situation sucks.

[tftmom]

That is what has me so shaken. I had a Bouvier that I took through Schutzhund training several years ago. I groomed professionally for over twenty years before an injury ended that and I went back and finished college. I have shown in obedience and conformation. Like you, I thought I was prepared for any situation.
I also feel guilty because I woke my dog up that morning to go for a walk. My vet said, "you couldn't know what was going to happen. Stop beating yourself up." On some level I know that, but when you take on an animal you take on not only the responsibility for caring for them but for protecting them as well; I have replayed it and replayed it in my mind. It happened so fast. I'm sure the dog would have killed her on the spot if I hadn't reacted as quickly as I did. Still, I feel like I failed her.
I have bought some mace which animal control told me to get so I'm feeling a bit more at ease. This morning I began walking again. I'm walking earlier and I'm staying out of the housing tracts and walking the perimeter and around the nearby high school.
I gave the people a certain date to respond with reimbursement. I'm waiting until that date to contact animal control again about what they are doing with the dog.
Thanks to all for letting me vent and for your support.

[eagle12167]

if you need a permit to carry mace then try this, buy a squirt gun add about 3-4 table spoons of vinegar and carry it with you. or you can use amonia about 1-2 teaspoons or until you can smell it through the water. amonia can temporarly blind if used in small doses, large doses will blind permantly. when the dog comes after you aim for the nose. the smell of either will make a dog think twice. don't hesitate empty the squirt gun in his/her nose. if the owner comes over and gives you crap, shoot her with it too.

[Fotobits]

I am sincerely sorry to read of your loss, and I cannot believe the other dog's owner has not stepped up and at least apologized.

As others have discussed, mace only works downwind. I've found wasp spray highly effective. It comes out in a concentrated stream, does no permanent damage, and really stings the dogs when you hit their eyes. It is also effective from 15-20 feet away. I've only used it once, and the dog in question learned his lesson and left me alone afterward.

I know nothing can make up for the trauma and loss of your dog, but I wish you luck making the owner take responsibility. I don't even want to imagine how I would feel in your position, but I know that if my dog had done that I would have taken full responsibility, and had the dog put down.

[SiNNiK]

sorry for your loss tftmom, i'd like to know what happened with this, it's been a month since you've posted.

please? :D

it's things like this that make me glad my dog is ginormous.

[tftmom]

First he challenged me that my dog had a previous condition which caused her death, not the attack. I provided them with treatment records, invoices and letters from the two vets who treated her. I also provided three ads showing the cost of a puppy. My dog was an International Champion. I told him I would accept the cost of a puppy to settle out of court. He wanted to play "let's make a deal" over the vet bills!!! He further stated that my dog was old and not worth anything. He attacked me personally in his letter. I am taking them to small claims court. I'll post the outcome.

[SiNNiK]

you go girl!

and thanks for posting.

[tftmom]

I had my day in small claims today. I was awarded all my vet and report expenses, court costs, and $1000 for loss of my dog. I feel vindicated in that the guy was forced to not only reimburse my expenses but had to acknowledge that Abby had value. I don't feel the money compensates me. I lost her she is gone forever. But he was held accountable and heard from someone else that Abby had value. I'm glad it is over. Thanks to everyone who responded.

[DiggityDogs]

Congratulations! I don't know if I would have had the heart to go through with it and have to tell the story over and over... I'm glad it worked out for you!

[GSP4619]

That is good news tftmom. It really stinks that you had to loose a dog and I am truly sorry :( . But on the good side you might of just been the one who opened these nitwits eyes to take better control of their dogs and not just so freely let them run out onto other dogs.

[wyattabby]

wow, I'm so sorry for your loss..

I never saw your response to what happened to this dog who attacked yours and the mailman? is it still living next door to you?

I had a neighbor who thought his boxer was "trained" well enough to be off leash a few months ago..well one night i'm taking my two out and I hear someone yell, I turn around and here is this boxer bearing down on my us. I stomped and yelled but he kept coming. we initially had our back to him but once both of my dogs saw what was going on they both stood tall and he put on the breaks and ran away. I gave the owner a few choice words because not only could he have hurt one of my dogs but he most certainly could have been hurt himself by two dogs larger than him that are a pack. anyways, since then he is very selective as to when he allows his dog off leash now as I have not been the only one to have words with him.

[tftmom]

Animal control gave them a warning, whatever that means. The people told me they have the dog in obedience class now, a good thing. They plan to put a claim into their homeowners insurance to reimburse what they have to pay out. I expect that their insurer will tell them they will have to get rid of the dog or they will cancel the policy. I don't think it is as over for them as they think.

Yes, it was difficult to have this court date hanging over me and having to recount, again, everything that happened. At the same time, I felt I had to do this for Abby. I couldn't let them kill her and walk away.

[tftmom]

I had to post again on this in case anyone else finds themselves in my situation. Three days after my court date this woman began walking this dog by my house everyday and hanging out in the park across from my house. She is NOT obedience training this dog, it still walks ahead of her. I called animal control and found out that at least in California animal control can not put restrictions on how a dog is handled. They only enforce what a judge puts in place. I was told these people probably found out and that is why they settled outside the court room. If I had taken them into the court room instead of agreeing to arbitration the judge would have at least put restrictions on this dog.
Last week she went by my house allowing the dog to drag its leash and walk two houses ahead of her! One of my neighbors saw her and called animal control. Because she violated the leash law, along with what happened to my dog she was told that if there is one more complaint against her they will take action against the dog. No one has seen her in our tract for a few days now. The sad thing is, though the dog has a strong prey drive which is why she killed my dog, it is the owner who is at fault yet, eventually it will be the dog that pays with its life. Still, I have to protect my other dogs and my neighbors feel they must protect themselves so we are going to stay on top of this.
Moral of the story: Learn your local laws and if you have to, take them to court to hold them responsible.

[DiggityDogs]

God I wish there was a way to punish that lady. The sad thing is with someone like that she probably won't even miss the dog all that much. She's more interested in her feelings than what could potentially happen to her dog! I would DEFINITELY keep on top of it, and if I EVER saw that dog on my property you could bet that if I could catch it, I'd hold it until animal control came to get it, and if I couldn't catch it, I'd make sure to bug animal control until they got the point. Sometimes these situations make you feel so completely helpless!!